Pavlo’s Substack
Product&Growth Show
Thinking visually, building marketplaces, and turning spreadsheets into products with Jonathan Hey, former CPO of ZenEducate
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Thinking visually, building marketplaces, and turning spreadsheets into products with Jonathan Hey, former CPO of ZenEducate

Last week, I had the chance to chat with Jonathan Hey. He is a former CPO of ZenEducate and was also an early member at NutMeg, an online investment platform acquired by JPMorgan.

ZenEducate is one of the UK's major edtech success stories. They are building a marketplace for substitute teachers.

It was one of the companies Rhys Spence from Brighteye Ventures mentioned to me when we first met.

Later, they reached out to ask if I’d consider working with them, but the timing wasn’t right. However, I really wanted to learn more about them, so I asked Rhys to introduce me to Jonathan, a former CPO at ZenEducate.

What I learned from Jonathan

On product craft

  • As a Product Manager, you are paid to make complicated things sound simple and digestible so people can understand. Period.

  • Empathy and understanding of customer problems are more important than domain knowledge.

  • Turning a spreadsheet into a product is trickier than it seems! Spreadsheets are super flexible and let your team work however they want, without needing strict processes.

On metrics

  • Liquidity is key. You need to make sure you know how your supply works.

  • Match quality.

  • Trust.

  • Your product strategy should be designed around optimising these three.

Random takeaway

  • Investors will not try to impact your roadmap if your numbers go up.

What we also discussed

  • Is writing books more exciting than building products?

  • Where does Jono’s love for sketching come from?

  • How can PMs learn sketching to communicate their ideas more efficiently?

  • The power of explaining ideas visually

  • ZenEducate and the problem they are trying to solve

  • Why building empathy matters, regardless of your domain

  • How has ZenEducate’s product organization evolved?

  • How do you build a product strategy for a growing startup?

  • How do you balance what your investors want with what your customers want?

  • How will AI disrupt edtech?

  • Pavlo is bragging about his experience trying to use AI avatars.

  • The hardest problem Jono has had to solve at ZenEducate

  • Why building what a spreadsheet does is not a trivial task

Tune in!

Or here on Substack!

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